Wednesday, January 16, 2008

Dying In Their War, And What Thanks Do We Get?

BRUSSELS, Belgium – Some of America’s closest NATO allies reacted with surprise and disbelief today to reported comments from U.S. Defence Secretary Robert Gates suggesting that their troops fighting the Taliban in Afghanistan are not up to the job.

The Dutch Defence Ministry summoned the U.S. ambassador for an explanation of a Los Angeles Times article that said Gates complained about soldiers from Canada, Britain and the Netherlands not knowing how to fight a guerrilla insurgency.

'09 and out. If the Harperites want to argue the point, bring 'em down.

26 comments:

Ti-Guy said...

That's because the Allies are not shoving enough glowsticks up the insurgents' bums, like the sophisticated American military is doing over in Iraq.

...which of course, has worked so well.

Anonymous said...

Liberals are pussies & cowards.

Bend over so the Taliban can give you a good one.

Raphael Alexander said...

I don't think Canada need lectures from a politician. Canada is succeeding in Afghanistan despite the Americans, not because of them. Had they stayed and finished the job they started, instead of getting sidetracked into invading an irrelevant country, Afghanistan might be independent by now.

Dante said...

Two points.

1.I would hope we are there for reasons other than the Yanks. There are humanitarian considerations.
2.The USA is the worst insurgency fighter in the history of armed combat. A bit rich for them to judge.

Ti-Guy said...

1.I would hope we are there for reasons other than the Yanks.

I used to want to believe that, but I just don't see much point anymore. Certainly, a reaction like that from Gates reveals a desperation that is out of proportion to any damage to strategic interests a humanitarian crisis could cause...there are such crises all over the World right now.

Sure there are humanitarian reasons to think being there is a good idea to be there, but good intentions don't explain reality.

They've got two Friedmans left.

Canajun said...

Anonymous @ 4:39:

"Liberals are pussies & cowards."

That's a bit rich coming from someone who hides behind the veil of anonimity.

Anonymous said...

amne bro . . fuck the UN and their multilateral missions at the behest of legally elected governments.

Never again, we should just opt right out the UN, it is so corrupt it cannot be reformed.

Holly Stick said...

Arogant bloody Americans, bombing civilians like the cowards they are.

Anonymous said...

we have to get out now because Steffi has just announced he wants us to be part of the invasion of Pakistan.

Raphael Alexander said...

Yes, I noticed the Dion commentary as well. It's interesting to hold two apparently contradictory ideas in one's head at once: mission in Afghanistan is wrong, but invasion of Pakistan is right. It's time for the Liberals to gain some consistency.

Anonymous said...

I love Stephane Dion, as the Quebec polls consistently show, the more he says and the more people get to know him, the less likely they are to vote for him.

It's no wonder that when he was out of the news in December the Liberal numbers went up.

bigcitylib said...

Raphael,

The idea is that Afgh. is doomed to failure if you can't get some kind of handle on what's happening in Pak. If you can't, then there is no reason for Canadian troops involving themselves in a mission that is doomed to failure. Seeing both sides of that equation is like being able to walk and chew bubble-gum at the same time. Dion is capable of this, and so I think are the bulk of the Canadian people. Are you?

Raphael Alexander said...

Dion is capable of this, and so I think are the bulk of the Canadian people. Are you?

If this is more than meaningless posturing, then Stephane Dion should partake in binding commitments to stay in Afghanistan under a renewed mandate. Otherwise it's just that: meaningless posturing. Dion talks the talk. Can he walk the walk?

Ti-Guy said...

Dion talks the talk. Can he walk the walk?

Yeah...smoke on your pipe and put that in!

Ti-Guy said...

Mark Steyn NRO colleague and hate-spewing Republican harridan Lisa Schiffren is illiterate:

What about rendering unto Ceaser that which is Ceaser's, and unto God that which is God's? Mike Huckabee is going to force those of us who have wanted blah blah..*hiss*...*snarl*...

"Ceaser?" What flop-house do they recruit these people from?

Anonymous said...

"Dying In Their War, And What Thanks Do We Get?"

It's not a war, it's an occupation, just as it was for years under the Liberals.

It was a Liberal government that sent us there and a Liberal government that signed us up for combat missions and a Liberal government who knew we would be transferring prisoners to and working in partnership with a third world country not known for human rights.

None of this sticks to Harper - none. He recently expressed exasperation on national TV at the length of the occupation, noting it is longer than WWII; this is not the rhetoric of a warmonger.

Support for the occupation has barely been over 50% among Conservative supporters for two years running now, so you can't say he's playing to his base, which is split on the issue.

Ti-Guy said...

He recently expressed exasperation on national TV at the length of the occupation, noting it is longer than WWII; this is not the rhetoric of a warmonger.

What a rube. Harper attached himself to this issue right at the beginning of his mandate, with his "Red Fridays" and shoveling money into the CF. He can't start moaning about now that it's become undeniable that it didn't work out for him.

You should listen to Conservatives themselves. They've certainly responded to Harper's dog-whistles in support of militarism.

Anonymous said...

Go see what's up with your comrade McClelland, TiGuy, either his site has been hacked or he's talking about hunting Jews and turning them into lampshades:

"You know, the more I think about it the more I think Jonah Goldberg is right. We liberals truly are fascists. So instead of wasting my time fighting the truth I think I’ll just hunt down Jonah and turn him into a lampshade."


WTF? I took a screenshot.

Ti-Guy said...

Pretty tasteless joke...not about hunting down Jonah Goldberg and turning him into something useful, though. I'd have suggested a doula, so he can make sure no other baby suffers the trauma he did when he emerged from his Episcopalian mother's thorny, gritty, barb-wired vagina.

Shop him off to the HRC, anony, forthwith. Make sure you show them teh screenshot.

900 ft Jesus said...

Anon 6:55 and RA: that’s bull shit about Dion wanting to invade Afghanistan, as you say. That’s dishonest, and out of context. G&M today -
“Mr. Dion made a comment to reporters about controlling the flood of terrorists from Pakistan into Afghanistan...Liberal defence critic Denis Coderre, who sat beside Mr. Dion when he made the remark, insisted yesterday the party was not advocating a military role for NATO in Pakistan - unlike U.S. presidential hopeful Barack Obama, who has mused about such an intervention.
The point of Mr. Dion's comment was to say that Canada wants NATO to work diplomatically with Pakistan to ensure Pakistan is part of the solution in the region, Mr. Coderre said.
"There's no way that we will send troops or stuff like that."

When people lie and twist things, it's usually because they have no argument

bigcitylib said...

Unfortunately, 900ft, I think an invasion is pretty much what it would take.

900 ft Jesus said...

I hope not, BCL, but I bow to your greater knowledge in this

Anonymous said...

Again, you fricken' moron, troops are not in Af'stan because of the United States, but because of the United Nations. Period. Are you stupid or are you lying on purpose?

Ti-Guy said...

Again, you fricken' moron, troops are not in Af'stan because of the United States, but because of the United Nations. Period. Are you stupid or are you lying on purpose?

Take your meds, dear.

Scotian said...

anonymous idiot at 11:51 am:

Actually we are in Afghanistan because of Article 5 of the NATO treaty being invoked after the 9/11/01 attack on NY and Washington by AQ. We ended up in Afghanistan because the Taliban government of the day refused to hand over bin Laden despite his being sheltered in their country by the leader of their government as well as allowing him and his group to have training bases for future attacks. Now, you can argue about whether we are doing any good, whether we should have continued after the Americans up and ran away to invade Iraq for no good reason, but the original reason we are there is not because of the UN (although that did get added into the authorities involved down the road) but because we are a part of NATO and Article 5 was invoked. If you did not know even that much of the basic history then you are in no position to be commenting yourself, let alone trying to take someone else to task for not knowing whet they are talking about.

Granted the mission parameters we have agreed to have evolved since the original invasion and we have become a more combat active element (mind you, it beats being in Iraq, so if this was Chretien's way of keeping us out and getting the American's off our backs it was probably a smart move even given the casualties we have taken and the stressing of our military capabilities, although we really cannot sustain it much longer, which is one of the main reasons I support withdrawal of the combat mission next year) since then, but that is how we ended up there and why.

Raphael Alexander said...

When people lie and twist things, it's usually because they have no argument

Before you go casting stones at conservative commenters, ensure you note that several lefty sites have led with the headline "Dion the Hawk" over this news story.