They're both nearing 60; they talked of when Kingston Road was called Highway 2, and York Road before that, conveying traffic from Toronto to the Eastern settlements a century ago. Because they drive, and this kind of history is important to them. Then they got talking about "self driving vehicles" for a bit, skeptically and cautiously. But they're fine. They'll retire before that wave of innovation hits. But after them comes a vacuum. Because a self-driving car won't "know" anything; it will just store data.

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